| Author |
Message |
|
|
Post subject:
 Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 05:49 PM
|
|
Joined: Oct 17, 2007
Posts: 68
Status: Offline
|
|
| I assume you set it up for them. I also assume you set it up with their ease of use in mind. Usage is everything after installation. |
Last edited by grasshopper on Sep 25, 2008 - 05:59 PM; edited 1 time in total
|
| |
|
|
|
 |
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 05:57 PM
|
|
Joined: Mar 16, 2008
Posts: 94
Status: Offline
|
|
| I installed it. I thought you said ease of use not ease of installation. I didn't set anything up with ease of use in mind. What does that mean anyway? It is the same way to use debian as most operating systems, you use a mouse to click on things. What do you find hard to use in debian that is easier in sidux? |
_________________
-debian sid live cd with installer-
aptitude install live-helper
lh_config -d sid -a i386 --debian-installer=enabled && lh_build
DEBIAN INFO!
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 06:19 PM
|
|
Joined: Oct 17, 2007
Posts: 68
Status: Offline
|
|
|
MeanDean wrote:
I didn't set anything up with ease of use in mind. What does that mean anyway? It is the same way to use debian as most operating systems, you use a mouse to click on things. What do you find hard to use in debian that is easier in sidux?
I seen you in the Debian forums. Are you a sidux user as well?
To me, ease of use is how easy a distro is to use after installation. For example, take the difference between using dialup on Debian and sidux. A friend of mine wanted to use Debian but they could never figure out how to make Kppp work. You have to add your user to the dip and dialup groups, of course. There may even be another step, but as I don't run pure Debian I don't know off the top of my head. On sidux, you click Kppp, add your information, and get online. And let's not even mention trying to get dialup going on Gnome.
That's a simple thing for an advanced Linux user to fix but not everyone who uses Linux is an advanced user, nor should they be. There is simply no excuse to make things more difficult than they have to be. One or two steps is the difference between being difficult and being easy.
And yes, many people in the world still uses dialup. Those people should not be ignored. |
|
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 06:32 PM
|
|
Joined: Dec 06, 2007
Posts: 310
Location: New Delhi
Status: Offline
|
|
I have used Ubuntu, now I prefer sidux. There is one reason I do not try Debian. I know that some of my hardware will not work with the older kernels. Not even with Lenny. My ENE card reader worked just one year back in Linux and I had to use W$ for 3 months till today to access internet as my USB EDGE MODEM from MICROMAX would not work in older kernels (maybe I did not try hard enough). It worked today with Ourea. How can I run Linux if I can not access net with it ?
Debian otherwise, as I have read in many forums, is neither hard to install, nor difficult to use. Debian users are used to those old days when they used to work hard to make it run, and it perhaps pains them to see the unstable sid run with so much ease in the form of sidux. Those who use simpler OS are not competent enough, that perhaps is the logic. So if you do not struggle inside the terminal day in and day out to just get you X or audio working, you are a noobie.
sidux is fast, very fast, It installs fast, it boots fast even when using 'fromiso'. It has good hardware detection. It has execellent manual and excellent forum support. So I have got stuck to it. Once it is set well configured, I do not fiddle with it too much. So it stays healthy.
Debian has a different user base. If it runs on your hardware, you can sleep in peace. |
_________________
http://linux.ixcodes.com
In a lunatic asylum, everyone thinks that he is the doctor.
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 06:36 PM
|
|
Joined: Dec 19, 2006
Posts: 1030
Status: Offline
|
|
This endless comparison between parent and child is getting tiresome to follow, so is the need to justify our (the sidux community) existence.
We exist because Debian exists, because Debian free software guidelines allow us to exist and because we enjoy having an healthy community of people interested in running the unstable branch.
We don't cause problems for Debian or its developers, we contribute back, albeit with relatively minor things, wherever that is possible and makes sense. We manage a small-as-possible delta to the Debian package archive while following the same policies as the Debian archive itself.
We have fun using Debian. |
|
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 06:42 PM
|
|
Joined: Oct 17, 2007
Posts: 68
Status: Offline
|
|
| How well does Debian run "fromiso?" |
|
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 06:53 PM
|
|
Joined: Mar 16, 2008
Posts: 94
Status: Offline
|
|
|
Quote:
For example, take the difference between using dialup on Debian and sidux.
My mom uses dialup and I do not recall having to configure anything in particular beyond entering the required info. |
_________________
-debian sid live cd with installer-
aptitude install live-helper
lh_config -d sid -a i386 --debian-installer=enabled && lh_build
DEBIAN INFO!
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 07:26 PM
|
|
Joined: Dec 19, 2006
Posts: 1030
Status: Offline
|
|
See /usr/share/doc/kppp/README.Debian, specifically the bit about "noauth" and /etc/ppp/peers/kppp-options.
Does this help settle this pointless subtopic? |
|
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 07:55 PM
|
|
Joined: Mar 16, 2008
Posts: 94
Status: Offline
|
|
|
dptxp wrote:
I know that some of my hardware will not work with the older kernels. Not even with Lenny.
this not new enough?
http://packages.debian.org/lenny/linux- ... 6.26-1-686
how about
http://kernel-archive.buildserver.net/d ... linux-2.6/
or just grab a sidux kernel if it works.
Kernels are easily added/removed and are fairly separate so you can grab one from just about anywhere. Shouldn't let a old kernel version stop you from anything. Grab a newer one and pop it in! 
Quote:
Debian otherwise, as I have read in many forums, is neither hard to install, nor difficult to use. Debian users are used to those old days when they used to work hard to make it run, and it perhaps pains them to see the unstable sid run with so much ease in the form of sidux. Those who use simpler OS are not competent enough, that perhaps is the logic. So if you do not struggle inside the terminal day in and day out to just get you X or audio working, you are a noobie.
So you think debian users really prefer the old days and struggling to get things working? Honestly? This debian user certainly doesn't miss the old days. I just didn't think of sid as being 'hard' before sidux nor do I think of it as easy in the form of sidux now.
Oh, and a newbie is just someone new - much like rookie or other word. It isn't negative or positive, it is just a identifier. You can make it negative (clueless newbie) or positive (smart newbie). |
_________________
-debian sid live cd with installer-
aptitude install live-helper
lh_config -d sid -a i386 --debian-installer=enabled && lh_build
DEBIAN INFO!
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 07:57 PM
|
|
Joined: Mar 16, 2008
Posts: 94
Status: Offline
|
|
|
kelmo wrote:
See /usr/share/doc/kppp/README.Debian, specifically the bit about "noauth" and /etc/ppp/peers/kppp-options.
Does this help settle this pointless subtopic?
Ask him.  Does sidux uncomment noauth by default? |
_________________
-debian sid live cd with installer-
aptitude install live-helper
lh_config -d sid -a i386 --debian-installer=enabled && lh_build
DEBIAN INFO!
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 07:59 PM
|
|
Joined: Mar 16, 2008
Posts: 94
Status: Offline
|
|
|
grasshopper wrote:
How well does Debian run "fromiso?"
What is that and why would my kids, wife or my mom want to do that? Whatever it is, I am sure debian can do it. sidux is debian afterall. |
_________________
-debian sid live cd with installer-
aptitude install live-helper
lh_config -d sid -a i386 --debian-installer=enabled && lh_build
DEBIAN INFO!
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 08:04 PM
|
|
Joined: Oct 17, 2007
Posts: 68
Status: Offline
|
|
|
kelmo wrote:
See /usr/share/doc/kppp/README.Debian, specifically the bit about "noauth" and /etc/ppp/peers/kppp-options.
Does this help settle this pointless subtopic?
It does prove my pointless point, so thank you for that.  It appears that not even advanced users are aware of them.
Meandean doth protest too much. Slow day on the Debian forums?  |
Last edited by grasshopper on Sep 25, 2008 - 08:11 PM; edited 1 time in total
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 08:09 PM
|
|
Joined: Mar 16, 2008
Posts: 94
Status: Offline
|
|
|
kelmo wrote:
This endless comparison between parent and child is getting tiresome to follow,
same is true for every comparison...
Quote:
so is the need to justify our (the sidux community) existence.
Do you feel the need to try? Why? Nothing wrong with sidux existing. Nothing wrong with choosing sidux if sidux is what a user wants. There is nothing wrong with debian either though. It isn't harder, sure it does some things differently otherwise sidux and debian would be the same. Differences are good and should be appreciated regardless of which is a users preference. Certainly expressing why we prefer one over the other is valid discussion. I prefer valid discussion to vague 'its better' or 'its easier' or 'its newer' kind of conversation so I always ask for clarification when I run across that.
Quote:
..because we enjoy having an healthy community of people interested in running the unstable branch
I consider sidux to be sidux not the unstable branch of debian. Sid is the unstable branch of debian and many users run it as well as lenny. That being said, sidux is certainly based on the unstable branch and valid bug reports are always a good thing.
Quote:
We have fun using Debian.
Don't we all.... |
_________________
-debian sid live cd with installer-
aptitude install live-helper
lh_config -d sid -a i386 --debian-installer=enabled && lh_build
DEBIAN INFO!
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 08:20 PM
|
|
Joined: Dec 19, 2006
Posts: 1030
Status: Offline
|
|
|
MeanDean wrote:
Do you feel the need to try? Why?
Because I spend a lot of time working on bits and pieces for Debian and sidux and sometimes it is good to write down these reasons to clarify them to myself and others.
MeanDean wrote:
Nothing wrong with sidux existing. Nothing wrong with choosing sidux if sidux is what a user wants. There is nothing wrong with debian either though. It isn't harder, sure it does some things differently otherwise sidux and debian would be the same. Differences are good and should be appreciated regardless of which is a users preference. Certainly expressing why we prefer one over the other is valid discussion. I prefer valid discussion to vague 'its better' or 'its easier' or 'its newer' kind of conversation so I always ask for clarification when I run across that.
I dislike that too, so I pointed to the specific reason that grasshopper may find kppp troublesome on a Debian system without knowing about a specific piece of information which is well documented within the package documentation. It was a frustrated attempt to move the discussion onto something else ... |
|
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Post subject:
Posted: Sep 25, 2008 - 08:27 PM
|
|
Joined: Mar 16, 2008
Posts: 94
Status: Offline
|
|
|
grasshopper wrote:
It does prove my pointless point, so thank you for that.
Yep, I am convinced. Debian is unusable. I will let everyone know... I will let my kids know that they will no longer need to uncomment that line in a text file or just run kppp using kdesu but rather will be expected to kill X to upgrade because they will be switching to sidux. |
_________________
-debian sid live cd with installer-
aptitude install live-helper
lh_config -d sid -a i386 --debian-installer=enabled && lh_build
DEBIAN INFO!
Last edited by MeanDean on Sep 25, 2008 - 08:36 PM; edited 1 time in total
|
| |
|
|
|
|
|
|
