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Post subject: Goodbye sidux
 Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 08:47 AM
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Joined: Nov 30, 2006
Posts: 636
Location: USA
Status: Offline
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Too many stupid forum rules, if mentioning certain things is such a pain then move the damn forum to a different country. I take it the forum is hosted on a german server where mentioning certain things is a big no no.
Fed up with not being able to tell people what works or how to do things in the forum or in IRC just to have someone jump down my throat.
Every other forum in the Debian community has no problems mentioning the things that are taboo here, so the issue certainly can't be because they have more money.
All of the above plus the fact that people here are so critical of other distros, namely the *buntus, which is just silly. Means it is time for me to move on. I know this will probably get deleted since the mods here like to delete posts.
h2, shame, slh keep up the good work. |
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Debian Tips My Debian sources.list
"If you can't apt-get something, it isn't useful or doesn't exist"
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Post subject: RE: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 09:44 AM
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Joined: Dec 02, 2006
Posts: 584
Location: Övarp
Status: Offline
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| This will never be the reason for me to leave sidux but I agree that it is a pity that we can't discuss certain things and I also have had the thought before that why not move the server to somewhere where we can have a more free forum, free from stupid laws against what we do anyway. As I have understood before sidux is looking for a new server, please consider to put the server somewhere else. |
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"Crazy! I mean like so many positive waves maybe we can't lose! You're on!"
Last edited by Oddball on Feb 11, 2007 - 09:48 AM; edited 2 times in total
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Post subject: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 09:45 AM
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Team Member
Joined: Nov 24, 2006
Posts: 3872
Location: berlin
Status: Offline
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craigevil,
we dont delete any posts at all here, unless they are discriminating in a way or illegal!
so, please dont spread FUD here. if you have to move on, do that. but dont make big issues out of things that most users just accept.
greetz
devil |
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>>we are sidux - resistance is futile - you will be assimilated<<
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Post subject: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 10:27 AM
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Team Member
Joined: Nov 24, 2006
Posts: 2695
Location: w3
Status: Offline
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?? I really don't get the message:
Someone does not want to use our forums, because we friendly ask him to not link to ONE SINGLE REPOSITORY, which is easy to find anyway. What's the attraction there being so important?
The Microsoft owned codecs? Wow - you think promoting them would be a good thing for supporting free and open source software? Feel free to directly link to the Microsoft download site.
The **multimedia**? That's a fine piece of software, and if you want it you know how to get it.
The DVD-related libraries? Yes, probably it's that one. Do you know the legal risks the owner of the unmentionable repository is taking already for you? You want us to take similar risks? You want us to move servers around, hide like criminals, risk to hole project - just to make it possible for you to link them here? Well, if it's really that what you want, you probably really better find yourself another place, where a big corporation or a billionaire is backing those legal risks. We simply cannot do it - sorry.
And let me add: Freedom of speech is very important to us. That's why we are actually one of the few Linux related forums were topics are almost never closed, definitely never deleted (except duplicates and real illegal stuff), and always friendly moderated. We even allow a lot of controversial political discussion in "Anything Goes" - try that in the forums you love so much more ...
Greetings,
Chris |
_________________
an operating system must operate - sidux.com
development is life - code.zikula.org
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Post subject: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 10:38 AM
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Joined: Dec 02, 2006
Posts: 195
Location: Nürnberg
Status: Offline
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Question to craigevil:
Where are the links to "the things that are taboo" on your own homepage?
greetings
hschn |
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Post subject: RE: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 11:00 AM
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Joined: Dec 01, 2006
Posts: 304
Status: Offline
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well spoken slam, wellspoken devil,
only thing ye can say is: law is stupid now and then. dont blame sidux for that. |
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Post subject: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 11:08 AM
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Joined: Jan 10, 2007
Posts: 1061
Status: Offline
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Quote:
I know this will probably get deleted since the mods here like to delete posts.
How did you come to this strange opinion? Sorry, this was just a boring standard sentence of people that make forum-critic posts. Not really ingenious.
Quote:
All of the above plus the fact that people here are so critical of other distros, namely the *buntus, which is just silly.
Do you now the "Ubuntu Vista" Thread? I guess everyone likes it, no matter of the used distro.
OK, Ubuntu is not the favorite distro of most posters here, but what did you expect? The ones whoose favorite is ubuntu are in the Ubuntu forums. Here is the sidux forum. So what? No one wanted a war between Distros.
Regards,
Blue Shadow
and sorry for my bad english |
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Post subject: RE: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 11:40 AM
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Team Member
Joined: Nov 27, 2006
Posts: 2034
Location: buffalo, ny
Status: Offline
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Let me be very Blunt
Code:
No Comment
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.... _
... (0)>
... / / \
.. / / . )
.. V_/_sidux powered
You can check out any time you like ... but you can never leave
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Post subject: RE: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 11:49 AM
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Joined: Dec 02, 2006
Posts: 584
Location: Övarp
Status: Offline
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Craigevil is pissed, I'm not, I have also had one thing removed from the forum ones, I don't remember if it was from sidux or Kanotix forum and I have respected that, I respect all the rules from everyone who puts out a forum, your forum=your rules. Can I just get an answer without getting somebody angry? Is the laws in Germany about this things different from other places and is it then not possible to take that under consideration when getting a new server in the future? I don't think anybody want sidux to "move servers around and hide like criminals" For me it's more hiding an suspect to say like "come to the irc and talk about that because we are not aloud to do it open on the forum" instead of doing it on a forum.
I must say that I don't know really what it is not aloud, and why, I would like to know and understand. |
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"Crazy! I mean like so many positive waves maybe we can't lose! You're on!"
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Post subject: RE: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 12:03 PM
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Team Member
Joined: Nov 27, 2006
Posts: 2034
Location: buffalo, ny
Status: Offline
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Hi oddball  we don't get angry, after we delete a thread it usually comes with a very nice pm explaining why it was deleted and a thank you for understanding, yes, German law is different, any lawyer in Germany who finds (or actively looks for) such 'violation', can send us a costly dissuasion, which we don't have the money to pay for. That could be the end of the sidux project. After we send a person the same pm a couple times it does raise some eyebrows. It's not very hard to go to irc  Slam or devil can explain this better than I can.
http://sidux.com/module-Legal.html |
_________________
.... _
... (0)>
... / / \
.. / / . )
.. V_/_sidux powered
You can check out any time you like ... but you can never leave
Last edited by piper on Feb 11, 2007 - 12:10 PM; edited 1 time in total
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Post subject: RE: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 12:10 PM
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Joined: Nov 25, 2006
Posts: 571
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| next time you sign to a forum please read the legalese as it seems you have not read this one http://sidux.com/module-Legal.html |
_________________
Why do strong arms fatigue themselves with frivolous dumbbells?
To dig a vineyard is worthier exercise for men.
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Post subject: RE: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 12:18 PM
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Team Member
Joined: Nov 24, 2006
Posts: 2695
Location: w3
Status: Offline
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@Oddball:
The biggest legal risk we are facing, is a very well known library needed for de- and encoding different types of DVDs. It is illegal to distribute this tool in many countries around the world, and even illegal to assist people in installing/using it in some countries. Even private usage might be illegal in some stricter legislations. Our problem is the "assisting people in obtaining/installing/using them" term, because where ever we put our servers, it might still be a legal problem for the user who asked, the person who actually answered here, the project initiators, our developers, .... I hope you get the message now.
Several states in the US and many countries in EU belong to the countries affected by such legislation - so we can never be sure, because most of our users come from one of these countries. We are a small community project without corporate legal backing, and with real people involved here who already are voluntary taking several legal risks for sidux. So, please don't wonder if some of them (including me) get nervous when someone demands from us to intentionally break the law.
There are other - not so critical - legal risks we manage, but most of that is handled fine meanwhile. The sidux Foundation is part of our strategy here, collecting some donations in order to be financially able to fight unjustified blackmailing against us is another one.
Most people understand that - we have discussed the topic so many times @kanotix and here. But twice a year there will always turn again someone starting lengthy discussions about freedom of speech and how he understands his own rights here in our forums. Those people are usually the last to actually overtake responsibility or risks for our community, they just try to provoke and feel better afterwards. Anyway, I am not interested in their intentions - what they do is simply bad for sidux and it's users, so I take care for a fast Goodbye for them.
Thanks for understanding.
Greetings,
Chris |
_________________
an operating system must operate - sidux.com
development is life - code.zikula.org
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Post subject: Re: RE: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 12:44 PM
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Joined: Nov 30, 2006
Posts: 4063
Location: Budapest
Status: Offline
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Oddball wrote:
Is the laws in Germany about this things different from other places and is it then not possible to take that under consideration when getting a new server in the future?
imho it's not the law, it's the interpretation of law, which might become very expensive. That does not only vary between countries, but might also change within one country or depend on the amount of money, a person/company wants to spend to chase somebody legally or sue them.
So precaution might be very important, and when you follow the track record of the last months, patent wars and licence wars are on the way. I say licence wars as well, because outside of the US of A there are no patents, but licences.
Also in the Linux camp things are changing rapidly:
- Novell-Microsoft-pact
- Linspire-Ubuntu-pact
- Mandriva (single registration)
All these moves are about licencing, and in case of the Novell-Microsoft-pact about software patents.
And imho there is a war about market shares from the Linux side as well (Novell, Shuttelbuntu, Mandriva, Linspire):
- you pay, you get the licences
- you don't pay, you don't get them.
It's still the wee hours of the day, but I think, I see a pattern, and it does not look promising for distributing licenced codecs for free, even if the downloader is entitled to use them, because he has the licences (I have far more valid Windows licences than Computers, no Windows running, so I can use anything from Microsoft's Windows distribution I am licenced to legally on any of my Linux boxes - but may I distribute that stuff?).
Let's see for how long those Hungarians (**multimedia**) and French (vlc) will be able to distribute codecs without being harrassed. Not to mention stuff from some Norvegian.
"War is just a shot away", and I can hear and see armies mobilizing, and they are recruted from the own camp as well against their own people.
And to continue my doomsday-vision: small distributors like Sabayon who provide all you need out of the box regardless the licence situation will be crushed by the time the Novell/Shuttlebuntu/Linspire/Mandriva-camp has settled for the "legal" approach selling nice looking, fully functional Linux desktops with all the closed source multimedia goodies.
hubi |
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Bonitas stultitiaque sodales sunt.
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Post subject: Re: RE: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 01:14 PM
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Team Member
Joined: Nov 24, 2006
Posts: 2695
Location: w3
Status: Offline
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@hubi:
And - what's even more frightening - two more observations:
1) The corporate backed big Linux distros are on their way to implement the closed source codecs crap as a world-wide multimedia standard, and free and open source alternatives will loose attention, users and developers.
2) By respecting each others "intellectual property" software patents and/or related licenses, they become a practical legal blackmailing tool - the more it's used, the more the public & legislators will acknowledge it.
Greetings,
Chris |
_________________
an operating system must operate - sidux.com
development is life - code.zikula.org
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Post subject: Re: Goodbye sidux
Posted: Feb 11, 2007 - 01:37 PM
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Joined: Dec 05, 2006
Posts: 1221
Location: Wiesbaden, Germany
Status: Offline
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craigevil wrote:
? ? ?
CRAIGEVIL,
I do not understand your emotional reaction. I have not followed the discussion that followed up your collection of letters ordered in that way.
I do not focuse on that. But what did bring you to shout around here? Is it a private thing, is it a combination of several circumstances around you? What brings you to dictate people who operate a community how they do it?
I am interested in whether you can do a discussion based on facts and personal respect?
I wish you all the best |
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Viele Grüße
mylo
Linux 2.6.30-0.slh.7-sidux-amd64 x86_64 [ sidux 2008-04 Πόντος ]
Intel Core2 Duo E6550 @ Cache/Ram 4MB/4GB nVidia G72 7300 2*250GB
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